Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help

Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - Printable Version

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Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - radiohenry - 08-03-2022

OK I've read a couple posts of what to do but no luck so far. Have tried PB Blaster, heat , and force with no luck. I just added some WD-40. A side problem is the when I put a wrench to the shaft the whole thing turns. So I guess I will let it sit a little while longer and if the rust buster doesn't help the next step is to remove it.
I originally picked it up to use the chassis for another project that never happened. It's getting close to the junk me pile.

Does anyone have any recommendations? Bandswitch # 42-1046.

Thanks,
Henry

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - morzh - 08-03-2022

Henry

Show a picture.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - radiohenry - 08-04-2022

Mike,

Here are a couple pix of the bandswitch. I still have not broken it free and think I may have to try taking it apart , something I didn't want to do.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - David - 08-04-2022

Take your time apply a little WD-40 everyday for a week before trying to make it move. May take a week or three!.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - Chas - 08-04-2022

"Apply heat"

Get out the largest Weller gun, be prepared to maybe sacrifice the tip. Find a large solid knob with a flat pointed set screw and have at the ready. Flat set screw will not leave a "cup point mark".

Open the tip legs, those square wires and force around the shaft very close to the bushing, Be sure bushing nut is tight. Put on that good knob. Fire up the Weller, what is happening the shaft is short-circuiting the power yes some is going to the tip. Heat up til there is some sizzle from old lubricant, the shaft will now free up, feed a little more lube and manipulate as it cools..

GL

Chas

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - morzh - 08-04-2022

Well, I was about to say the same Chas has just said.

Your main problem is the threaded bushing (not sure what the set screw is doing there).

Apply copious amoun of PB Blaster, or any release agent, wait like a day., and then use your MIlwaukee gun and something that could squeeze the shaft so hard that it would not slip - small vice with textured cross-cut surfaces on the grips, or a big pair of pliers also with the same, and really try to move it. Once it starts, it will progress fast. I had that problem on the 66 model.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - Chas - 08-04-2022

Just to inform: Using a large knob with an Allen set screw to lock it on is fine, but tightening the set screw tight would ordinarily cause an indent in the flat of the shaft, like from a cone point or a cup point set screw. A flat or dog pointed setscrew will still get a good grip but wont chew the flat of the shaft. If there is no flat this is more important as it may be a problem to get this large grip knob off if a cone or cup pointed set screw has mushroomed the shaft, fix one problem and create another?
Though the steel shaft will expand with the heat the bushing will expand more, the added space and heat will cause the "shellac" harden lubricant to mix with any oil added and give way.

Its great to get things moving again but to damage them in the process, well, not workman like.

GL

Chas

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - morzh - 08-04-2022

When I was restoring VoM record player, the shaft of the large sprocket was frozen shut. I could not rotate it with anything, and using the sprocket itself as a lever mad the sprocket rotate around the flared shaft it was secured on.

I used an immense amount of heat by my Milwaukee gun. And then a hammer to knock it out. It took a very serious effort. And the stuff that held it....it was like supercement. No glue could match it.

Heat, heat and then some more heat. As long as you don't melt it.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - John Bartley - 08-05-2022

When you have tried all else and nothing has worked .....

- get an adjustable wrench set to grip the flat on the bandswitch shaft
- have some oil in a needle oiler or small spout can with light oil ready to go
- fire up a propane torch with a tight flame if you can
- heat the shaft (not the bushing) until you see smoke starting to wisp up from the lube you have already applied to the bushing

This is where it gets dicey ..... keep applying heat trying to maintain a balance between applying heat and causing damage - it will be hotter then you think and at the same time try to rock the shaft back and forth with the adjustable wrench.

As soon as it starts to move even a bit, quit ..... apply some penetrating oil between the shaft and bushing and let it cool.

Sounds brutal .... it is .... but "with care" I have done it and seen it work.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - MrFixr55 - 08-05-2022

Similar procedure to removing bolts connecting exhaust pipe to exhaust manifold on a rust belt car. The technique works! One alternative is to heat both the shaft and bushing, cool the shaft with penetrating oil with the bushing still hot. A gap should open. (almost microscopic but a gap none the less).

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - radiohenry - 08-05-2022

I thought I replied yesterday but anyway ;thanks for all the suggestions. I guess I need to soak it more.
I used an Ungar broad tip iron to apply heat because the duty time on the Weller iron is 1 minute on and 4 minutes off and I did not want to chance ruining the gun.

Also I used a small adjustable wrench but the whole switch moves . I did put a socket on it to tighten it up and it felt like it was going to strip or break so I stopped that. For the time being I will let it soak and then try heat again.
Thanks,
Henry

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - John Bartley - 08-05-2022

Quote:I used an Ungar broad tip iron to apply heat

Toss the iron. You need HEAT. Fire up a torch.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - morzh - 08-05-2022

Agreed. This is why I said "Milwaukee gun". You could use a torch, but guns work just the same and are less prone to create fires.
But Iron is merely 200W. If it is a big one. Not enough.

RE: Model 118 frozen Bandswitch Help - Chas - 08-06-2022

He, he, I often forget that much of the tools I use are truly vintage, many much older than I. The Weller I have is very large, very heavy with a medium brown Bakelite case. Model number plate is missing. I run that gun to the point its smokin' and it keeps on keepin' on. Uses the large copper tips, I often makeup tips of #12 or #10 buss wire as the OEM tips are getting pricey. That is the gun I use on frozen switches and tuning shafts.

Henry I do agree with

Yes, I have a torch, a very small Weller (again) mini-butane torch/soldering iron. I seldom use it because or fire hazard but it's great for jobs away from power, like antenna building.

Do be careful backing up the switch body as it can twist, distort the indent plate, break the wafers or permanently loosen the mounting bushing from the frontplate of the switch.

Henry, I do agree with John, it ain't hot enough yet...

Chas