The PHILCO Phorum
37-116 Period Correct Wiring - Printable Version

+- The PHILCO Phorum (https://philcoradio.com/phorum)
+-- Forum: Philco Radio Discussions (https://philcoradio.com/phorum/forumdisplay.php?fid=5)
+--- Forum: Philco Electronic Restoration (https://philcoradio.com/phorum/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+--- Thread: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring (/showthread.php?tid=3391)


37-116 Period Correct Wiring - qanerd - 06-21-2011

Although the wiring is intact on 99% of my 37-116, it doesn't seem to take kindly to being moved around and is threatening to crumble if I disturb it too much.
Two question if I may:
The wiring now appears to be all one color. After almost 70 years it's pretty faded. Does anyone have a handle on whether these were originally all one color? If so what color and if not, is there a reference for period correct wiring color someplace?
I have seen a couple of what appear to be good sources for replacement cloth-covered wire (Radio Daze and Sundial). The Radio Daze is lacquered and the Sundial is not. Any thoughts as to what to use to achieve a period correct restoration? Any experience or preferences out there?
There is a pattern on the present wiring and it would be great to be able to replicate that if anyone knew a supplier.
Thanks in advance
Chris G

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - Arran - 06-21-2011

Is this wiring above or below chassis? If it were me I would only worry about period correct wiring where it shows, like grid cap leads, speaker cables, wiring to the shadow meter, and the dial lamp sockets. It seems unnecessary to bother with being authentic on the under chassis wiring since you can't see it, but it's your radio.
Regards
Arran

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - codefox1 - 06-21-2011

Well colored wires changed a lot over the years. AC lines were grey (or black and white on later sets that were somerthat polarized, Thick green was always 6.3m and the center tap was green/mostly with white or black. The classical filament winding was yellow, and not always center tapped, Secondaries were almost lways were red, and the center tap could be just about anything. but it should be easy to find out with an ohm-meter.

Many times the colors are so faded and distorted that it is not easy to see what is going on, so a little cold (off line) tracing is in order just to see what is going on.

Finally if the wires coming out of the transformer are frayed and worn, there is nothing to prevent you from opening the bells, carefully replacing leads with proper insulation, or using heat shrink tubing, etc.. and launching the device into the next century of use.

In the end, you decide.

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - qanerd - 06-21-2011

I'm not too concerned about wires that are out of view but I'd like anything that can be seen to be correct.

Anyone have any experience with lacquered vs. non-lacquered wire? I've heard a few stories about non-lacquered being a pain in the kiester.

Thanks guys. Appreciate it.

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - codefox1 - 06-22-2011

Just no telling what color they will fade to. After all did you think you would have the same color hair you did all that time ago, if you still have some? Me neither. Once again green was the 6.3 winding, yellow was the 5.0 winding, and red was the high voltage winding. Center taps were usually staggared colors, sometimes the 6.3 had a yellow trail, the cener tap of the 5 volt winding may or may not be be present, and could be any color, but the b+ enter tap almost always had a varigated color scheme. You can always take out all the tubes, and fire the set up, and measure what you find. All will be up a little bit, maybe a lot,because there is no load applied.

Put a 1 Ampere fuse ahead of the transformer before doing any measurements. Tell us wyat you have found.

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - qanerd - 06-22-2011

Color aside, anyone have any experience with lacquered vs. non-lacquered wire?

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - exray - 06-22-2011

I don't know who might be selling non-lacquered nowadays but I'd personally shy away from it. Several years ago, the lacquered type disappeared on the market at RadioDaze and AES and the substitute was awful to work with because it frays so badly.

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - qanerd - 06-22-2011

Radio Daze seems to have it again in both stranded and solid:

http://www.radiodaze.com/catalog-306-page43-44.pdf

Thanks for the advice; lacquered was my inclination.

Chris G

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - exray - 06-22-2011

Yes, the good wire is back. The 'drought' only lasted about a year.

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - qanerd - 06-22-2011

FYI: A quick search has turned up a lot of promising leads:

http://www.tubedepot.com/wire.html
http://www.magnetoparts.com/wire.htm
http://www.sundialwire.com/sundialwirehowtoselectcloth-coveredwire.aspx
http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinting.com/tubesandparts.html
http://jedamp.com/products.html
https://secure.cedist.com/scripts/foxweb.exe
http://www.riwire.com/

Thanks exray

Chris G

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - Arran - 06-22-2011

Sometimes the schematic or a wiring diagram will tell you what the colours were even if they faded, you may not be able to get the exact period correct coloured wire that Philco used but you should be able to get something close. In my experience the part that is exposed will fade but if it's covered up it won't so much, like if it has an end that goes into an IF can or something. It is an old radio so something close is perfectly acceptable, for all you know the shade of green or red may have varied from whatever roll of wire they used from day to day. I don't know if the factory wire was always lacquered, some appears to be but in other cases the insulation is sort of loose, I think if the cloth looks sort of glossy then it was probably lacquered or varnished.
Regards
Arran

Re: 37-116 Period Correct Wiring - qanerd - 06-22-2011

Thanks Arran. That thought had occured to me. Still slowly disassembling and I haven't rolled it up yet but I'll bet the old colors show through on the bottom side.
Regards
Chris