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Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - Printable Version

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Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - TA Forbes - 01-20-2012

Hello, I recently got a Philco model 14 code 221 chairside and a model 17chairside, code is unknown. I was using a schematic for the model 14 code 226 for electronic work, but there are several differences between my set and the schematic.

Are there schematics and associated information available for the model 14 code 226 chairside?

I have not researched it but assume the same is true for the 17 chairside, so same question for the 17 schematics/info.... Also, it appears that the 17 has the standard four pin plug for the speaker and the chassis has the power cable vice the flat multi lead cable that goes from the chassis to the speaker of the 14, so I am wondering if the 17 chassis is the right one for the chairside cabinet.

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - Ron Ramirez - 01-21-2012

Hi Tom

It sounds like you have the early 1933 model 14LZX chairside since it has the flat 8-conductor connecting cable. Does only the center section of the top flip open? If so...that's definitely a 14LZX.

http://www.philcoradio.com/gallery/1933a.htm#a

Later on, after a new selling season had started, Philco began to offer four different chassis in the same chairside cabinet. The chairside unit looked similar to the earlier 14LZX...only now, the entire top swiveled open instead of the center section flipping open. These sets, which came with a revised 14 chassis (that is very different from the earlier 14LZX) as well as 16, 17 and 18 chassis, do not have the flat 8-conductor cable to connect the chairside unit to the speaker unit - instead, they have 4-conductor cable.

http://www.philcoradio.com/gallery/1933c.htm#f

The schematics for the two versions of Model 14 differ. The early 14, Code 226, is identical to a late version of Model 91 with twin speakers; both are covered in Service Bulletin 129-B. The later 14, Code 121 (cathedral), 122 (console) and 123 (chairside) is in Bulletin 174.

The 17 was offered as a chairside, so what you have is probably correct. It is code 123; the 17 schematic is in Bulletin 161 (early production) and 161-B (later production, more information).

One more thing. The knobs on a 14LZX are laid out like a 91; close together. The later versions of the 14 are spread apart more, like the 17.

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - Radioroslyn - 01-21-2012

Nice find!!! I had a 91 CS years ago.
Terry

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - TA Forbes - 01-22-2012

Hello, Ron/Terry: Yes, the 14 is the early variant with the center portion of the radio opening to reveal the controls. Interesting, the dial has only BC band but the power/band switch has 3 positions. The tuning cap is very similar to those you see in the earlier 20/70/90 models, but it is a 3-gang vice a 4. It does have a shadowmeter and it does work.

The 14 had some old repairs/mods that were poorly done. Both 8mFd electrolytics had paper replacements installed in parallel with the originals. Several of the bakelite blocks that were in ctc with B+ were leaking black tar, and the 1st det Xfrmr primary was open. After a re cap and rewind of the transformer, the radio now works but volume is low. (Primary is now only 1 ohm vice 4.5 ohms, I wound it 25 turns like the original but used slightly larger diameter wire.)

Are there schematics out there for the code 221 model 14 chassis?

Thanks for easing my mind about the model 17 chairside. I did not get a speaker with it, like I did for the 14. However, I do have a model 118 console speaker that should work for the time being. It is a smaller chairside than the 14, and has the lid that slides siideways as you described above.

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - Ron Ramirez - 01-22-2012

Contact Chuck for your 14LZX service info; tell him this is the early 14 that is identical to the late 91, and that you need Bulletin 129-B with any possible revisions/additions.

http://www.philcorepairbench.com/schematics.htm

The later 14 is a completely different radio, so Bulletin 174 will do you no good.

There should be some small numbers at irregular intervals above the AM band frequency markings on the 14LZX; this is for the SW band...unless Philco screwed up and installed the wrong AM-only dial scale (it could have happened). This would be the same dial scale as used on the later 14, the 17, the early 18 with AM and low SW...and the late versions of the 91 which also have a three position off-on-band switch.

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - TA Forbes - 01-22-2012

Thanks, Ron: I just sent Chuck an email about the 14.

The dial scale is definitely broadcast band only. Until I have the set working properly, I won't be able to tell if there is a shortwave band available on it.

There are a number of differences between this set and my schematic, which is for a model 14 code 226. I am going to shelve working on it until I have a better schematic to work on it. Well, I say that now while I am on the computer...... Icon_wink

Since there were so many sets with so much in common around the period that this set was made I am not suprised about the dial/band switch.

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - Chuck Schwark - 01-22-2012

TA,

Just replied to your order request. You'll get a nice boat-load of good stuff for that 14.
Any applicable Production Change Notes are included as a regular part of my packets.

Chuck

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - TA Forbes - 01-23-2012

Thanks, Chuck! They should be exactly what I need!

I went ahead and did some more work on it, and discovered three issues: 1. The lead connecting resistor 3,26, 32, cap 36, and the top of the volume control does not show as connected on the schematic, which it is; 2. One lead had been improperly connected to the wrong side of resistor 3, I assume by whomever had added the audio jack to the set; 3. The oscillator coil connected to the cathode of the 36 tube was open. Additionally, the other two parts of the coil were connected in reverse.

I fixed the above issues, and the set now works well on frequencies below ~750KHz. Above 750KHz, it gradually fades out. Soooo, more to come....

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - TA Forbes - 01-24-2012

I took note of the Philco Service Tips in Chuck's site and replaced the "good" 36 tube with another "good" 36 tube, and now have good reception throughout the entire broadcast band! Weird about those dang 36 tubes. Now I remember why I never liked the model 19/89 sets that I had, as the 36 tube/oscillator circuit always seemed to be an issue.

BTW now I am looking at Ron's section about replacing the 36 with a 6A7. Hmmmmmm...

Re: Questions about model 14 and 17 Chairside radios - TA Forbes - 01-24-2012

BTW the 19 chairside I do have was restored by Bob Timms, who is a suberb electronics tech.