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Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Printable Version

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Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Philco281989 - 05-26-2013

Hey guys I am trying to re-stuff this electrolytic can for a Philco 71B cathedral, once I cut open the electrolytic I noticed There was a mesh screen around the wall on the inside of the can, in the center was a metal like waffer that I had already thrown away. My question is where would I tack on the ground side of the electrolytic, there is a cardboard sleeve that sits around the section of the can where the clamps hold it in place so it does not short the can out.

Here are some pictures, as you can see there is only the post that comes out the center, the positive side of the electrolytic will go on the inside of the post, but I don't know where to connect the negative.

That cardboard collar goes around the clam that hold the can in place. That tab that come off it is just a connection point that other connect to under the chassis.

Could the negative side of the electrolytic be the can it's self.

Do I need to leave the mesh plastic screen in the can, what was it used for?

Thanks

Jon

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - morzh - 05-26-2013

Jon

1. Yes the can is the negative and it was isolated from the Chassis, hence the paper collar.
2. You leave NOTHING inside. God knows what chemical the mesh still keeps in itself and what it will do to the new caps. Gut fully, clean, stuff with the new part and do not waste your time trying to make the can the negative pole again, just make two wires, black and red, come out and use them. In which case you no l'onger need the paper aropund the can except if you want to keep it looking original.

For the future, any electrolytic can you restuff - you ONLY keep the can and discard everything else.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Philco281989 - 05-26-2013

Could I drill a small hole that goes through the can and solder the neg side of the electrolytic to the can that way. I would do it in a place where the cardboard sleeve covers the can. I am looking for the most authentic way so when you look at the can you will not be able to tell.

Here is where the positive lead come out of the can, it is the center screw coming out of each can. The neg side of the original electrolytic must of touched somewhere inside the can.

Philco repair bench shows a way to re-stuff a mershon cap, I not this is not the case for me, but I could do something just as similar. Let me know if this is feasible.

Thanks

Jon

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - morzh - 05-26-2013

1. You cannot solder to the can as it is aluminum. It cannot be soldered to.
2. Yes you could take a tinned copper strip and rivet it to the case, and then solder to it. Some caps were this way so it would ne authentic, but a rivet is only so much reliable and may potentially oxydise over time.
3. Using two wires you don't have to isolate the can from the chassis.

Any way you could output two wires is fine. I go for the simplest one.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Mondial - 05-26-2013

You can bring out the negative lead out the side of the can at he bottom and solder it to the metal tab under the insulating sleeve. This tab was the original negative terminal which contacted the metal can to make the connection. That way you will have a reliable soldered connection and the cap will look original when reinstalled.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - morzh - 05-26-2013

This is what I did on my 18 actually. Only I brought it from the bottom (I did not care much about this level of authenticity) as a bare wire and soldered it to that same tab.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Ron Ramirez - 05-27-2013

You can see my method of rebuilding electrolytic cans here:

http://philcoradio.com/phorum/showthread.php?tid=14922

You will note that I drill a small hole in the bottom for the negative lead. The negative lead gets soldered to the solder tab that is used as the negative terminal, and which just rests against the electrolytic condenser can, held in place by the paper/cardboard insulator. Other than the drilled hole, once reassembled with the paper/cardboard insulators, the cans still look original. Icon_thumbup

I agree that everything that was originally inside the can should be discarded. The plastic mesh screen was used to insulate the positive terminal of the original electrolytic from the negative. The can itself was the negative side. Now, I have to disagree with Morzh about discarding the paper/cardboard insulator as it holds the solder tab against the can. Reusing this as I did in my 38-14 rebuild as shown in the link above preserves original appearance.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Philco281989 - 05-27-2013

Thank you mondial, and thank you Ron, much appreciated. Reading and seeing a visual of what you did majorly helped out.

I will do it exactly as you did. Is there any secret to getting that perfect cut circle all the way around, I always have a heck of a time trying to get a even lined cut, but I did use a hack saw for these two cans so that might explain it.

Jon

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - morzh - 05-27-2013

Ron

I have to disagree with you disagreeing with me Icon_lol

I never said to discard the paper cardboard insulator. I actually reused it myself as I reused the tab in the 18.
I only said to discard the guts; the cardboard is optional but there is no need to discard it.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - BrendaAnnD - 05-27-2013

I have used a tubing cutter with good results.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - jerryhawthorne - 05-27-2013

I have never made perfect cuts when cutting a can apart (I use a dremel with a cutoff wheel). I use to make an index mark so I could align the two parts. Now I just take them to a bench disk sander and "true" both parts. The cardboard tube holds the two halves together quite nicely along with the clamp.
Jerry

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Ron Ramirez - 05-27-2013

With all due respect, Mike, you did say this:

morzh Wrote:In which case you no l'onger need the paper aropund the can except if you want to keep it looking original.

For the future, any electrolytic can you restuff - you ONLY keep the can and discard everything else.

I'm just sayin', keep the paper insulator as it enables you to reuse the solder terminal originally used as the negative solder point.

No arguments here. I'm too tired to argue. The cabinets I'm trying to redo are getting the best of me already.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Philco281989 - 05-27-2013

Ron, have you started the 200/201 restoration?

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - morzh - 05-27-2013

Jon

http://philcoradio.com/phorum/showthread.php?tid=5404&page=2
http://philcoradio.com/phorum/showthread.php?tid=5404&page=3

Here's the thread where I put some photos of the caps exactly like this one (one single and one dual) with cardboard insulators, before and after.
There I re-used the tab and the cardboard.

RE: Help with installing a new electrolytic part - Ron Ramirez - 05-27-2013

Philco281989 Wrote:Ron, have you started the 200/201 restoration?

Nope. I've been utilizing what little spare time I have working on cabinets, and giving my website a facelift. Maybe I should be working on the 201 chassis instead, considering how the cabinet work is going.

Actually, the 201 is several sets down on the priority list. As far as chassis work goes, the McMurdo Silver is on top of the list, although I would like to finish that Tropic 42-761...