more 41-250 questions - Printable Version
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more 41-250 questions - electroubleshooter - 12-22-2007
I got the pushbutton switch assemby removed and after looking over the radio it appears that about 95% of the wires will need replacing.
Is this normal for this particular chassis? How many of Philco's other chassis will have this problem?
Any hints on restoring this radio? It appears that i will have to remove the bandswitch assembly as well.
How many hours does it usually take to restore one of these (caps and rewire)?
Do customers pay what it's worth to restore one of these? The labor cost must be through the roof.
What would a restored radio of this vintage be worth?
I am new to restoring vintage sets. So far I have restored 3. I have been in electronics for 20 years though I am now on disabilility. I am buying a few radios to restore for the experience then hope to repair a few as a business.
- Ron Ramirez - 12-22-2007
Hi
Questions answered inline...
I got the pushbutton switch assembly removed and after looking over the radio it appears that about 95% of the wires will need replacing.
Is this normal for this particular chassis?
Yes.
How many of Philco's other chassis will have this problem?
All Philco sets made between 1939 and 1942. You can also unsolder one end of each wire, remove the remnants of the old rubber insulation, then resleeve with color-coded heat shrink tubing.
Any hints on restoring this radio?
Take your time and be patient. To get at all of the old rubber-covered wiring, sometimes the bandswitch on these models (41-250, 41-255, 41-256, 41-280, 41-285, 41-287, 41-290) must be disassembled, to avoid breaking the bandswitch wafers. You'll also need to disassemble the IF cans and replace or resleeve every wire.
It appears that i will have to remove the bandswitch assembly as well.
Or disassemble it...by removing the two nuts that hold it all together and then pulling the individual wafers apart...being careful not to lose the spacers that go between the wafer sections...
How many hours does it usually take to restore one of these (caps and rewire)?
A LOT. Too many, in fact.
Do customers pay what it's worth to restore one of these?
Sometimes yes, sometimes no.
The labor cost must be through the roof.
If the job is done right...it has to be, in order to be fair to the person doing the restoration work.
What would a restored radio of this vintage be worth?
As much as someone is willing to pay for it. And nowhere near as much as the time and effort you must put into one of these to properly restore it.
Not trying to be a smart-you-know-what here. But in all honesty, my feelings on "what is it worth" are similar enough to Steve Adams' thoughts on this subject that I usually refer those looking for values to this page on his website. (Steve owns the Radio Attic.)
Good luck on that 41-250. You're going to need it.
- electroubleshooter - 12-22-2007
Thanks Ron,
Looks like a nice challenge.
I have been replacing the wires one by one
Where do you get the heat shrink? Antique Electronic Supply?
Thanks
- Ron Ramirez - 12-22-2007
I get my heat shrink locally, at the only remaining electronics distributor in Evansville (Hutch & Son), in five foot lengths. It comes in clear, white, yellow, red, green, blue, and black. I do not buy the clear, but I get the other colors. When slipped over the wires and shrunk, it looks very authentic.
You can probably buy it online from one of the distributors such as Mouser, Allied, and/or Digi-Key.
- Terry Judkins - 12-22-2007
Here is a short spiel relating my experiences restoring a 41-255.
http://home.comcast.net/~suptjud/philco41255.htm
Ron pretty much covered it all. If you have difficulty aligning the push buttons try replacing the 370pf mica cap numbered 21 and 21B in the Rider schematic. It is a dual cap and I am not sure it really is a mica cap. I have found them bad in a couple of radios of this design and vintage.
Like Ron said, it is a LOT of work but a nice radio when working properly.
- TonyJSenior - 12-23-2007
Very nice transformation on the 41-255 Terry! I have a table model 38-7 that is missing a few pieces of veneer on the front. Is working with the paper thin veneer relatively easy? I've yet to attempt to do anything with this cabinet nor done any veneer work. Seems to me that with the paper thin product matching and cutting the patch would be simpler.
- Terry Judkins - 12-23-2007
I have used the thin veneer on several radio cabinets and had good results. It may have been dumb luck.
Where I needed thicker veneer to match existing veneer I just glued on extra layers.
- Ron Ramirez - 12-23-2007
Terry does GREAT work on those vintage radios, doesn't he?
Thank you, Terry, for pointing out that dual 370 pF cap connected across the bandswitch - that, too, will need to be replaced. The original is either mica or a very early ceramic affair, insulated only by a wax coating that breaks down over the decades. It is two 370 pF capacitors in one package; one wire is common to both units.
Terry, in my experience, nearly every one of those units has been bad and required replacement.
It needs to be replaced with two separate 370 pF mica capacitors - if you cannot find 370 pF, 390 pF will work well.
Do not use ceramic disc caps to replace this unit - use silver mica. Ask me how I know this.
- bill T - 12-23-2007
Hi , I just wanted to comment on the original post. I am a novice but have done 4-5 prewar set with help for sites like this . If you have a digital
camera take a bunch of shots from all angles of the under side of the chasiss wiring . I find no matter what brand of radio I work on the one wire one side at a time does not always work. You get into areas (band switch or push buttons ) where it is easier to take off more than one end .
The digital photos have helped me every time . Kind of an obvious tip but
it is a time saver . Also my first set has been running for many years.
I did it pretty quickly . Now I take a little bit at a time approach ,and think it results in a better job for me. However you do it I am sure that the result will be worth it . Just wanted to mention the camera tip. Good Luck with it !
Best Regards,
Bill T
- FStephenMasek - 05-09-2008
Thanks Terry and Ron for that tip on the dual 370 pf capacitor. I saw "mica" on the parts list and was going to ignore it. I was just checking the chassis yesterday to order the capacitors, resistors, Etc. I need. At least the cabinet probably only needs some Howards finish restorer.