1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help

1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Printable Version

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1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - radiohenry - 08-25-2022

Sometimes you run into a real skunk and this one is it.

How do I remove the 1st if can cover? I thought it would be straight forward but not so much. It's a round can with what appears to be two posts protruding thru the top and two 1/4 " hex nuts holding it in place with an adjusting screw in the middle. I removed the two nuts and expected the can to be loose and easy to remove. It is not . It did not budge so before I break anything I thought I would ask.

This is the one that had the frozen band switch, and a host of problems . It seems I go from one to the next and as an aside the SW is dead. I would like to take it out side and shoot it !.
Thanks,
Henry

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Greg - 08-25-2022

The transformer attaches to the can (cover) by those 2 posts on top.
The can should have posts or clips that protrude through chassis, holding it to the chassis.

To remove the can, you have to detach the transformer (assuming it's still wired) from the can (remove nuts) and the release the can from the chassis (remove nuts or undo clips).

I assume you want to remove the can leaving the transformer in place.

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - radiohenry - 08-25-2022

Greg,
I did not see any posts or hex nuts on the bottom but I will recheck . The can seems to protrude thru the bottom of the chassis and looks like it was swagged or pressed in place.
I tell you I can see a curb in it's future.
Thanks,
Henry

Update,
I rechecked and see no posts or hex nuts on the bottom . It's as I remembered it. The can is somewhat obscured by a filter block but I also checked the 2nd if can and it is the same. I have removed and repaired IF cans in other brand radios before and it was always simple as Greg indicated. This time it is not.
Thanks
Henry

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Greg - 08-25-2022

Yea - I see what you mean. Took a look at a photo of one online.

It doesn't look like the can was ever meant to come off of the chassis.

Why do you want to remove it? To get to the transformer inside? If so...
Looks like the transformer comes out by removing the nuts on top and unscrewing the bolt to the chassis holding a metal tab connected to the bottom of the transformer.

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Radioroslyn - 08-25-2022

The cover doesn't come off. It stays on the chassis. The transformer comes out by removing the large black C clip between the cover and the bottom wafer on the transformer. Remove it and the nuts on top and it should pull out thru the bottom. I haven't taken one of these apart yet but that how it looks. Cover is pressed into the chassis so it's not made to come off.

Is the set working on the bcb and not on sw?

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - radiohenry - 08-26-2022

Terry and Greg,
Thanks for the assist. This is why I posted here instead of going for broke and maybe breaking something.

First of all yes,the radio is working on Am and not SW . But I think a cap I don't remember the number in the if can is shorted or even open .
Originally on am the radio would wooooo not what I would call a whistle and make all kinds of noise but would not play. did replace the filters and a cap in one block that was shorted. Caps and resistors seemed ok. well if I removed the grid cap to the 78 if tube the radio would play fine . Further test appeared to indicate a bad cap in the if so I added the ,05uf leading to the grid . Now it plays but there still is an intermittent issue ( distortion / drop in volume) that can sometimes be corrected just touching the grid of the 78 ( 1st if).

I noticed that tuning on the sw band back and forth which is dead , nothing. But sometimes the woooooing would start on SW and again touching the grid and away it goes.
I tried other tubes, cleaned the socket etc... cleaned the switch checked the contacts .

I did see the snap ring but was not sure if it was to remove the IF assy and hoped I would find out more here.
It is only curiosity really that caused me to post as I have little interest in this radio. I originally acquired it for another project long gone now and the speaker, knobs and tubes are worth more than what I paid any way so it's no big deal to junk it.
Thanks,
Henry

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Radioroslyn - 08-26-2022

>Caps and resistors seemed ok.
If you haven't replaced the caps in all of the bakelike blocks and the four in #46. On #46 you can use 2.2mfd@450dc or 4.7mfd in a pinch for all.

Without replacing these these caps your asking for squeals, odd oscillation, and just general bad intermittent bad behavior.

I doubt that the IFt is the issue but is a red herring.

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - radiohenry - 08-26-2022

Terry,
I agree there is always the possibility for problems when not replacing all of the caps but I was just hoping to work thru quickly. Voltages looked good, and caps and resistors good except for the shorted ones I found. .

I need to order the small e-caps . Somehow I managed to only have on 2.0 uf left and no 1 uf. If I decide to go further with this radio I will do a total recap. (The speaker should be ok for a model 16 or 17 and I have those chassis as well. )I just don't like it that much. I used it as a tool to learn how to free up the band switch since I have a model 66 tombstone with a frozen switch as well.
Thanks ,
Henry

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Radioroslyn - 08-26-2022

Even a little leakage from the foil/paper caps can cause issues in the tubes bias network. Creating changes in gain and perhaps cutting the tube off.The 2.0mfd will be a fine replacement for the 1.0mfd.

You didn't mention which spkr size you have. You did mention some other chassis The 16's had 3 different spkrs. Cathedral 8" (K-17), tombstone 10 1/2" (H-13) and Console 10 1/2" (U2). The power supply is bigger in the console so the field coil is also (more voltage and current). That one wouldn't be my 1st choice for a table top set but the two are fine. If you have a 16 chassis that matches the K or H spkr you may want to consider finding a (B) cabinet and putting it back together. Complete they bring a good dollar and they are nice sounding sets. I have 5 of the 16/116Bs.

I have a 118B on the way in a few weeks and am looking forward to servicing it. It's a pretty straight forward set. Not like 38-690.

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - radiohenry - 08-26-2022

Terry,
I have the console version which is supposed to have the H-13 speaker. I have not removed the back to verify this yet. This radio was very close to going to the curb before I had the presence of mind to try freeing up the band switch in preparation to work on the 66. I need to free up space and will be making some hard decisions soon.
Henry

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Radioroslyn - 08-27-2022

On the H-13 not a bad idea to check the primary winding of the opt. I've run across a few open ones. Big let down. Can be done by just measuring the resistance from any of the four pins to each other. Should see no less than 5k or so.

On the 66 I have one of the Moderne style. Serviced it a number of yrs ago. Good player and was surprised that the calibration on the sw band is very good considering there's no adjust. PB Blaster is good stuff to loosen stuck parts. WD-40 is a waste of time by comparison.

https://philcoradio.com/library/download/service%20info/service%20bulletins/Philco%20Service%20Bulletin%20197.pdf

G.L.

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - radiohenry - 08-28-2022

Terry,
I removed the back just now and the speaker is an H-13 so that makes me happy. It didn't sound bad when I had the am on last week.. That makes it worth the price of admission.
Henry

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - radiorich - 08-29-2022

hello radiohenry ,
That is good news about the speaker !
Sincerely Richard

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - LDel - 01-11-2023

Earlier, in this post is a picture, of the underside of an IF Transformer. The wires are covered with what look like a crystalline substance. At present, I'm working on a Philco 118, and the bottom of both transformers, and their connecting wires are covered in this. Can someone tell me what it is? Thank you, in advance for your response.

RE: 1st IF can cover removal Philco 118 Help - Chas - 01-11-2023

Bees wax...

If it was PVC wire and sticky, it would be degradation of one of the ingredients in the plastic, if so that wire should be replaced as it will corrode copper..