The PHILCO Phorum
Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Printable Version

+- The PHILCO Phorum (https://philcoradio.com/phorum)
+-- Forum: Philco Radio Discussions (https://philcoradio.com/phorum/forumdisplay.php?fid=5)
+--- Forum: Philco Electronic Restoration (https://philcoradio.com/phorum/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+--- Thread: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic (/showthread.php?tid=10774)

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Ron Ramirez - 11-25-2014

(11-24-2014, 03:53 AM)Arran Wrote:  Current won't be an issue with the transformer, however the filament voltages, or even the plates running a bit high may shorten the life of the tubes somewhat.

Acked. I am going to double-check and make sure I am using the 125V tap and not the 115V tap on the transformer.

As for tube life, it isn't as if this will be a daily driver or be used to the point of abuse as it was before...in my care, it will enjoy a "life" of ease in its retirement, and will only be used occasionally. Icon_smile

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - NostalgiaRadioTime - 11-25-2014

Thanks, Ron. Glad you like it. I'd hoped you didn't mind my removing the painter's tape you applied, but I wanted to make sure the flocking stayed where it should've when it was taken off. Happily, it did! Icon_thumbup

I did the flocking in the basement workshop. It was somewhere between 60 - 65 degrees down there, so yes, there was some heat. Not sure how much of a factor that was or wasn't.

I will let it set to dry a few more days and hopefully be able to send it back to you Friday or Saturday.

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Ron Ramirez - 11-25-2014

No hurry, Greg. Thank you again! Icon_thumbup

I am sorry, I was going to remove the painter's tape and clean off the mess that was my third attempt at flocking, but I wanted to get your coil - and this part - to you right away, so I just sent it on "as-is". I hope you don't mind.

And, yes, based on my three failed attempts at flocking, I am convinced that heat - or the lack thereof - is definitely a factor.

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Ron Ramirez - 12-01-2014

With many thanks and my most sincere appreciation to Greg (NostalgiaRadioTime), I now have a great-looking, reflocked dial back plate.

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00034.jpg]

Here it is turned on, with the 5Y3GT removed since the speaker is disconnected:

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00035.jpg]

The piece of celluloid behind the four horizontal holes on the right end of the back plate was missing when I acquired the set. I decided to just print something out to use in its place:

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image.jpg]

...and here is a close-up of it, installed on the back plate:

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00036.jpg]

I used the Alternate Gothic No. 2 font which also matches the font used on 1939-1942 Philco call letter tabs. The font probably could have been a size larger, but it will do nicely, I think.

I still have to restring the cord that controls the placement of the bulb behind here, which indicates the proper band selected. The tuning dial cord is already restrung; I only need to reattach the pointer.

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Ron Ramirez - 12-01-2014

Using the dial scale scan sent to me by Mike Feldt, I made a negative image of it and then printed it to actual size to make alignment easier:

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00037.jpg]

And, yes, folks, it does work on all four bands. Icon_thumbup

Other than tying up a couple loose ends, this chassis is finally done! Icon_biggrin Icon_clap Icon_clap

This has been one of my most challenging electronic restorations. I am glad it is finally up and running again. Thanks go out to Greg (NostalgiaRadioTime), Mike (in KC), Sam, and Mike Feldt for helping make this possible.

Now, the cabinet may pose another challenge. You may recall that I previously mentioned holes having been drilled in the side. The holes correspond to alignment screws. So I wonder if those holes were drilled when the radio was built, or later?

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - NostalgiaRadioTime - 12-01-2014

Glad you're happy with the back plate, Ron. It certainly looks good now that it's back on the chassis!

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Ron Ramirez - 12-03-2014

Yes, Greg, it does indeed, and I am very happy with it! Icon_thumbup Icon_clap Icon_thumbup Icon_clap

A few more photos now to wrap up this topic:

Look inside the cabinet; you can see the spot where the original power transformer had a meltdown prior to my purchase of the set.

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00038.jpg]

Using some original old dial cord salvaged from a dead radio some time back, I restrung the mechanism that moves the band indicator lamp up and down. I also soldered the grounded end of cap (30) to the ground lug which is held in place by one of the screws and nuts that holds the dial back plate in place. Once the loose end of (30) was properly grounded, the volume dropped slightly but the tone quality increased.

After all this was done, the chassis went back into the cabinet.

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00039.jpg]

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00040.jpg]

Here is a close-up of the broken dial scale.

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00041.jpg]

You can't see Greg's fine reflocking work here, because apparently when the scale was broken, someone applied a piece of wide cellophane tape to the back of the dial to hold the pieces in place. Now the tape has yellowed and become hard, as this type of tape inevitably does. Once I have a new dial scale made, this problem will be resolved and the flocking will be visible once again. That isn't going to happen for a while, though.

You may recall that I had mentioned holes drilled in the right side of the cabinet, which line up with the alignment screws on that side of the radio chassis:

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00042.jpg]

[Image: http://www.philcoradio.com/images/phorum/42-720/Image00043.jpg]

I'm not sure what to do about those. Leave them, and the cabinet will always be an ugly duckling; patch them, and they will always show. Yes, that top band on both sides of the cabinet, going around to the front, is photofinish.

The original speaker was not attached to anything - it is merely held in place by being wedged between the speaker opening of the cabinet and the front of the chassis. This speaker is really too large for this set; it should have a smaller speaker mounted to the chassis as in the 41-240, 41-245, 41-712, etc. But since this speaker came with the set, and the chassis has a short cable with a 3-pin connector to connect to this speaker, I decided to leave it as it was made. It sounds very good and the set plays well now.

So that is it for this Tropic, for now. Perhaps next summer I will do something about the cabinet; when it happens, that will be a subject for the Philco Cabinet Restorations forum.

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Chuck Schwark - 12-03-2014

Use wood hole plugs and stain them to match.  Will look more likely to
be there than an open hole or plastic or metal or just open.

[Image: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_BV7ti_kvK4k/Sw6ogBb-4kI/AAAAAAAABVk/WCe3gzF9N2c/s320/wood_button_plugs.jpg]

Chuck

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Arran - 12-03-2014

 That set must have left the factory with those extra holes in the side, it's highly unlikely that some owner would have gone to the trouble of measuring out and drilling such a neatly spaced set of holes that happen to line up with the alignment screws in that side of the chassis. The average owner wouldn't have had a clue that the padders and trimmer screws were even there, let alone what they were for. If the set really was a prototype of some kind I would just leave them there, short of replacing a good portion of the veneer on that side there isn't really any way to cover them up successfully. If you don't want to look at the holes just put the set on a shelf with some books leaning up against that end.
Regards
Arran

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Ron Ramirez - 12-03-2014

(12-03-2014, 02:24 PM)Arran Wrote:   That set must have left the factory with those extra holes in the side, it's highly unlikely that some owner would have gone to the trouble of measuring out and drilling such a neatly spaced set of holes that happen to line up with the alignment screws in that side of the chassis.

Exactly what I was thinking. I'm leaning towards just leaving it as is for that reason. This set is clearly a pre-production prototype...with the sample electrolytics and trimmer condenser bank...and the speaker that is larger than a factory production speaker would have been. I'm thinking that I will try to find a decent 1942 escutcheon (yeah, I know, "Tenite" and "decent" are mutually exclusive), have a repro dial scale made, clean the cabinet up a bit and let it go at that. I would leave this wood escutcheon on there, but it really looks crude. Philco already had Tenite escutcheons of this size from production 1941 radios as well as a few of the soon to come (at the time) 1942 models, so I don't think the crude red oak escutcheon was applied at the factory.

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Sean - 12-03-2014

Ron,

If you do decide to refinish the set you could replace the photo finish with this product:

Vinyl Burl Wood Film

I purchased some to try on a cabinet that had been stripped before I acquired it and originally had a photo finish band of burl on it.  I was quite please with how it turned out.

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - PhilcoMike - 12-03-2014

(12-03-2014, 02:55 PM)Ron Ramirez Wrote:  
(12-03-2014, 02:24 PM)Arran Wrote:   That set must have left the factory with those extra holes in the side, it's highly unlikely that some owner would have gone to the trouble of measuring out and drilling such a neatly spaced set of holes that happen to line up with the alignment screws in that side of the chassis.

Exactly what I was thinking. I'm leaning towards just leaving it as is for that reason. This set is clearly a pre-production prototype...with the sample electrolytics and trimmer condenser bank...and the speaker that is larger than a factory production speaker would have been. I'm thinking that I will try to find a decent 1942 escutcheon (yeah, I know, "Tenite" and "decent" are mutually exclusive), have a repro dial scale made, clean the cabinet up a bit and let it go at that. I would leave this wood escutcheon on there, but it really looks crude. Philco already had Tenite escutcheons of this size from production 1941 radios as well as a few of the soon to come (at the time) 1942 models, so I don't think the crude red oak escutcheon was applied at the factory.

That would be my guess as well.  Most likely only the factory using a drill jig could do holes that neatly spaced.  They even chamfered the edges.  My question Ron is how do prototypes get out into the hands of the general public?  Sure couldn't see that happening these days.

Nice work!

Mike

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Ron Ramirez - 12-04-2014

Sean - thanks, excellent tip re: the burl walnut Di-Noc! Icon_thumbup

Chuck - not bad, but I don't know...

Mike (PhilcoMike) - well, there are a few prototypes floating around. Maybe more than a few. I recall some years ago that someone, I think it was Doug Houston, telling me about a model 16 chassis that had more than the usual four controls on it. The 43-720 prototype on Michael Feldt's site is another example. He told me that he has since sold that radio; I wish I had known that he was going to sell as I would have tried to acquire it.

Anyway...I own a 16-122 chassis that is rubber stamped "Property of P. R. & T. Corp." on the back; it had been removed from a 16L cabinet like the one shown here. And I also have a 46-421 prototype that has a very different cabinet than that which went into production. My 46-421 has a small typewritten paper inside like Mike Feldt's 43-720.

As to how they ended up in the hands of the public, I can only guess. Some lucky engineers or other Philco employees had the privilege of taking these home, obviously. From then, they were used to a greater or less extent. Some, like Mike Feldt's 43-720, were taken care of very well; others, like my 42-720, were used and abused until they suffered catastrophic failure (shorted 6X5 and power transformer in the case of my 42-720).

Had my 42-720 been in the same shape as Mike Feldt's radio, or nearly so, I would never have touched the chassis as I have indicated previously. I went ahead and rebuilt my 42-720 because it was so worn out and obviously abused.

And you're right - these days, prototypes are usually destroyed almost as soon as they are built. Back then, I guess once they served their purpose at the Philco factory, they were seen as just more products to be put to good use by someone.

RE: Next case - Odd Philco 42-720 Tropic - Arran - 12-05-2014

 I don't know what happens to prototypes at all these days, but then again the electronics business is much different, radios and TV sets don't typically use LC circuits that need to be tested. I suspect that Micheal Feldt's 43-720 prototype may have been refinished, at least it looks that way, it has a rather flat open grained look with no decals over the controls. Whether it was intended to be a prototype or not I can't see why they would not have given that cabinet a the full finish treatment since it would not have taken any special effort for the cabinet shops to do this. To me it looks like the cabinet on the 42-720 was simply a stock cabinet that was taken from the production line, and modified, with those adjustment holes and what not, the cabinet on the 42-131T looks almost the same but with two fewer controls.
  I think that the original finish could likely be saved by using a similar method to what Bob Andersen used on his 39-30 cabinet, where the original lacquer would be cleaned, have any holes in the finish touched up with a brush, sanded, and then sprayed over several times. With regard to the escutcheon that does look home made, rather good compared to some I've seen, to me it looks like some sort of Mahogany like wood judging by the grain, which is a complete mismatch to the cabinet.
Regards
Arran