[mvnaylor]

Hello forum,

My 17 year old son and I have started repairing turntables over the last few months and it has been an enjoyable experience...starting with teaching him what a record was!
We normally work on newer stuff (Technics, Dual, Marantz, etc.) but have come across a Philco 46-1203 to fix for an older lady.

We've already purchased a cartridge/stylus (love the guys at turntableneedles.com) and had the rubber roller redone. Here's the odd thing...the turntable seems to have a grounding issue.

When we first worked on it, we had it plugged in and were just putting a record on and when i touched the tonearm I got a little bite. I didn't notice it again until a day later.
I had a friend out who is an electrical engineer (I'm not good with electrical stuff) and he couldn't figure it out. We had every wire that went to the turntable removed and still had voltage when touching the top.
Well, this morning I played with it some more and made at least a discovery. When you plug the power plug into an outlet one way, there is voltage on the tonearm with the power switch off and if you flip the plug around, there is voltage on the top when you turn it on.

Needless to say, I'm a bit confused at this point and my friend had removed all the wires from the wiring block under the turntable. I think what I would like to do at this point is just cleanly solder the wires (including the capacitor) back on the wiring block. Here's my question.

I have the schematic but, as I said, I'm no electrician. Does anyone have one of these that they wouldn't mind passing along a high quality picture of that wiring block? And, of course, any other relevant info that you folks might have is welcome.

-Mike

[Paul Philco322]

Welcome to the Phorum and it is great your son has an interest in fixing things. Hopefully you can get some good info from the group here.

Paul

[morzh]

Mike

(I am Mike also)

I have recently (this last spring) have finished 48-1213 Philco with a record player.
The player was not original.

So,

1. It would be very helpful if you show us what you got. Many, many Philcos have non-original turntables in them. Mostly for the reason of the newer at the time (50s) ones having changers and being able to play 33 records.

2. Trace the plug. I was dumb enough to trust the wiring and, well...no, I did not get zapped, but my fuse got blown soon as I turned the motor on. They rewired it and in essence put the Grounding wire to the Hot line. But without the GND plug that was OK (they grounded the noise via a cap. Crafty fellas, I tell'ya).

So, unless fully original, DO NOT trust the wiring.
And then inspect it for fraying etc.

But first, let's see what you got.

[mvnaylor]

Let's see if this works. I added an open Google Photos album. Let me know what other pics you need.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/wfpS5Ei9ZVMqNrhn6

[morzh]

This seems the original one.
Notice the GND as such does not exist, and the radio itself is transformerless type; it would be AC/DC were it not for the turntable motor. (won't work with DC). So the "Grounding" is connecting the tonearm shield to the chassis via the capacitor C26.

As the radio has "semi-hot" (consider it hot for safety purposes) chassis, you would probably feel a little pinching upon touching, unless you are in fully insulating boots or on wooden floor....let's just say I would not operate this type radios in a wet basement barefoot..

So, check the wiring according to the sch

http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel...013585.pdf

You actually might be OK. Though I see someone was doing some non-factory soldering so should be re-checked.

[mvnaylor]

Thanks for all the good info, morzh!
I do already have the schematic but was hoping that someone could provide a good picture.

[morzh]

It is very few wires. Two or three wires for the power and sometimes the light, and a shielded cable for the cartridge. You have a cap separating the turntable frame from the chassis, making it an AC ground.
All in all, it is easy.
In my case it was an EM cartridge originally and then a transformer. But in the VOM turntable the cartridge is, like yours, ceramic. And the input of the radio was ill-suited to work with it, so I had to mod the sch just a tad.
That is, after I removed all the reasons for the fuse to blow

[Radioroslyn]

A voltage doubler can double dc?  >it would be AC/DC were it not for the turntable motor. (won't work with DC).<

[morzh]

Terry

Yes you are right. I did not pay attention. Mr. Willard would be upset with me. So would be Herr Greinacher.
It is AC only.

[mvnaylor]

Morzh (or others) do you happen to have a picture or a sketch of which wires go where on that wiring block? I'm no electrician and don't read schematics very well. I could solder it back together if I had a nice diagram!

[morzh]

Mike

Unfortunately I do not.
But reading the particular part of the schematic is easy - simply trace the wires on the drawing and match them with the Part Numbers from the chassis' picture.

It is not bad at ll, just looks a bit unnerving if you never have done it. Reading maps is even more complicated.

[mvnaylor]

I'm OK with maps but this seems really confusing.
This appears to be the part I'm interested in. https://i.imgur.com/Gzeem03.png
There are four spots on the wiring block and (I think) only four loose wires.

I have...
1. The black ground wire that attaches to the turntable near the center.
2 & 3. The red and black wires from the tonearm.
3. The fabric shielded wire coming from the power supply.

If I solder them each to a spot on the wiring block, that seems pointless.
Also, I have the capacitor and I cannot figure which wires it connects to.
Sorry I'm so needy in this department, but I figure I came to the right place for help. Trying to learn!

[morzh]

Mike

So. First your drawing.

1. The crystal has 2 wires. Both go through the shield.
2. That shield grounds to the metal of the turntable itself.
3. The same shield also connects to the cap C27 pin 1 (I use 1 and 2 just to tell the difference between the two).
4. One of the wires from the crystal (Crystal, Lowe wire on the drawing) connect to the other C27 pin, the Pin 2.
5. This Wire, C27.2 will also connect to the second shield, that goes to the chassis.
6. The second crystal wired, the upper one on the drawing, goes through the second shield to the chassis.


Now to the chassis.

1. The end of the second shiled, the one that came to the chassis, will connect to the C26. (The other pin of the C26 connects to the Chassis itself)
2. The Top Crystal wire, that came through the second shield to the chassis, will connect to the free end of R1 (looks like the volume pot) Phono section.

This is it.

[mvnaylor]

Well, I attempted to follow those steps but keep getting lost somewhere in the middle and I run out of ends. A picture is worth 1,000 words in this case. Does anyone have one or at least a sketch?

[klondike98]

Mike N, I've drawn out what I believe Mike (morzh) is saying and what I see based on the photos and schematics.  morzh, correct me if I'm wrong.

[Image: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ulxim057vawpbw....jpg?raw=1]

[I just updated the sketch to show the shielding on the crystal cable going to the phono chassis]