[Kenneth F. Besso Jr.]

Bum-mer

[Radioroslyn]

Would think that any of the 16, 116 (pre 1937), 660, and 665 would be good candidates.

[Arran]

Yes the transformer was totally disconnected from the filaments. Center tap was also disconnected.

 Is the insulation on the power transformer leads in good shape? Sometimes they can break right where they come out of a hole in the cover (or bell) in the transformer and short to the cover.
Regards
Arran

[NostalgiaRadioTime]

I pulled the transformer from the chassis and opened the clamshell, removing both halves and carefully sliding the wires from the hole. I checked it again under power (without a load), and there is definitely leakage between the primary and secondary against the core. From the secondary to the core was around 25 volts! But I have since located a 116 chassis for parts, and the transformer tested good. So just waiting for it to arrive. I can probably get the missing driver transformer from it too

[Arran]

I pulled the transformer from the chassis and opened the clamshell, removing both halves and carefully sliding the wires from the hole. I checked it again under power (without a load), and there is definitely leakage between the primary and secondary against the core. From the secondary to the core was around 25 volts! But I have since located a 116 chassis for parts, and the transformer tested good. So just waiting for it to arrive. I can probably get the missing driver transformer from it too

 It sounds like it was a mixed blessing in a way, by finding out that the power transformer being shot you had to look for a parts chassis and may have found a replacement for the driver as well. With regard to the driver transformer on the 116 parts chassis is the setup for the power output stage the same as the 16B with the triode connected #42s? The power transformer should not be a problem, even if it's from a 116X, but I don't know about the driver transformer as the console version uses 6A3 tubes.
Regards
Arran

[NostalgiaRadioTime]

I'll have to do a little more investigating when I get the chassis (it was shipped today) with regard to the driver transformer. All I can do is try it, if it works, great. If not, well then I'll go with the transformer Terry recommended.

In the meantime, I found a power transformer I had on hand that would work to try...it’s not the same shape or size so wouldn’t look right. In doing so, I found I have another problem with the radio...the filament circuit is grounded! Somewhere something is touching and that’s causing a draw. The transformer I'm testing with is fine...no leakage, so I know the problem is definitely when I connect the filament circuit. That's when the draw appears, even with no tubes in the chassis. I guess there’s some serious wire tracing in order!

[NostalgiaRadioTime]

Finally getting back to this after getting a usable transformer. If you're out there, Terry, here's where I'm at:

The audio output is strong and clear when I touch the center tap of the volume control. Using the soldering iron trick, when I touch the grid caps of all of the tubes that have them, I get a strong buzz through the speaker on each. I cannot receive any stations with a long wire connected direct to the antenna clip, however. But if I clip the antenna wire direct on to the grid cap wire of the #77 1st det. tube, I get several stations across the dial, albeit at a reduced volume and somewhat garbled sound. When I clip the antenna on the next tube instead (the #78 RF Amp), I get one station clear (not garbled), AM 620, a strong Milwaukee station but at very low volume. The rest of the dial is silent.

In checking voltages, P to K on the 42 driver tube is 129 and should be 190. On the #77 1st Det tube however, P to K reads 364! If should only be 185.

The antenna coil (#7) and the wave trap coil (#1) measure very close to where they should be, however. I get around 5.5 ohms on the #7 and about 2.2 ohms on the #1.

I'm stuck. Any help on what to check or what could be the cause would be most appreciated. Resistors all check good. I only changed the electrolytic caps and the few paper caps the set had. I didn't start restuffing blocks yet. I'm just trying to get the thing to play. I don't like going flat out replacing everything right off the bat.

[Radioroslyn]

I'm more of a replace all the paper caps before I troubleshoot kinda guy. Check #42 maybe open that would give you high plate voltage on the mixer. Can't think of any place in the set that has that much voltage, I think the filament of the 80 only has 325 or 350 on it. If your pt came from a 16X or 116X you may want to use a 5Z3 rectifier.

[NostalgiaRadioTime]

Thanks, Terry. Will check out #42. I've been using a power transformer I found from a model 610 to test. I haven't yet pulled the transformer from the 116X chassis (it just arrived on Saturday). Perhaps that 610 transformer just doesn't put out enough to power the 16 set. The reason why I didn't replace all caps at once is because this set was playing before I received it. The seller sent me a video of it playing. But, despite my pleas and instructions to pack it securely, it wasn't packed well and took a few hard hits in shipment. Hard enough to knock the shadow meter off and smash up the bulb and shield behind it. In fact the bulb connection from the shadow meter is what caused the filament circuit to become grounded.

[Radioroslyn]

You'll be roasting weenies on the top of that 610 pt if you use it in a 16.

[morzh]

The 610 xfmr is not adequate for a 16.

[NostalgiaRadioTime]

No, I know that 610 transformer isn't beefy enough for the 16 chassis...I was just using it to test for a brief time. I wasn't going to use it in the chassis.

Here are some pics of the parts chassis I received. I was told it's a 116, but the tube layout (and tubes) are identical to those used in my model 16, code 125. Also it has 4 bands, as does my 16. I thought most of the 116's had 5 bands?

Anyhow, can someone identify which I have based on these pics?
   

   

[NostalgiaRadioTime]

I think I found what the problem was...a small wire wound resistor buried under a paper cap I missed that was open. #14 and #15 on the schematic. It’s playing now with the antenna wire clipped on to the chassis as it should be. The Antenna clip on the chassis is also responsive when you touch it. So I think I can rule out an open antenna coil, which is good! With the new transformer installed it draws about 3 to 4 AC amps at 120 volts, which is a bit concerning. There was no draw on the transformer without a load. No leakage either. Everything checked good on the new transformer. I'm wondering if a bit of a draw is normal for an 11 tube set? Never tackled one with that kind of population before!

[Radioroslyn]

As a rough guide 1 amp equals about 100 watts. So at 3amps your at 300w which seems too high to me.

[Ron Ramirez]

...Here are some pics of the parts chassis I received. ...can someone identify which I have based on these pics?

That isn't a 116 chassis - it's a 4-band 16.

I am going to send you a PM about the drive mechanism on your parts chassis.